Written by Realjones, 1160 skill tailor of Albion Pellinor
Updated for spellcrafting and alchemy.
First, some information from Camelot Herald:
“When you are above 1000 in your main tradeskill, any item you can successfully make in that skill will now have an even chance (which translates as one in six, roughly - but remember it's random, and you can have streaks of good and bad luck) of being 94-99% quality, and a 1 in 50 chance of being 100% quality.”
(http://www.camelotherald.com/more/391.php)
To simplify the odds of getting a 94-99% item are 1 in 6 (it is exactly 16.33%) for each quality, and 2% for a 100% item (a masterpiece). 100% items have 25% more spellcrafting points than 99% items, which would make sense, since they are about 7-8 times as rare.
The material cost (or value) of an item is how much gold and silver worth of materials an item costs the crafter to make. Also, when you sell an item back to the vendor, you lose 25% of its material value. For example, if I make an item that costs 20 gold in materials, ill only get 15 gold for that item when I sell it to a vendor. That 25% loss is often referred as to the recraft cost. So the recraft cost is equal to the material cost of the item times (.25).
All crafters charge a mark-up, this is where their profit comes from. Keep in mind that crafters can charge whatever they want, but the generally agreed “fixed price” method markup for crafters at this time (based upon quality) is:
98% quality = 2x material cost
99% quality = 3-4x material cost
100% quality = 15x material cost
These prices include recraft costs. Note that the crafter may or may not charge for recrafts on top of these markups as compensation for their time, as each item tier 10 item takes 2-3 minutes to make and we also have to run for materials, wait for you to pick items up, etc. If this is the case, the markup will generally note be as high.
Now I am going to use math (eeek, not that!) to show where these numbers come from, as people tend to freak when they see 15x cost ;)
Note that the formula for determining how much an item costs the crafter to make is:
Price = (material cost + recraft cost), and remember from above that recraft cost (for each try) = material cost x .25, so:
Price = material cost + (material cost x .25 x number of retries). This is not the cost to the customer; this is how much the item costs the crafter to make.
100% quality items (masterpieces): The odds of getting a masterpiece are 1 in 50. There will be an AVERAGE of 50 tries for each masterpiece. This means that in those 50 attempts, 49 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .25 x 49) = material cost + (12.25 x material cost), or 13.25 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 13.25 times the material cost of item to produce a masterpiece. The cost to the customer of 15 times the material cost provides a small profit for the crafter.
99% items: 99% items have approx 1 in 6 change of being made. This means that there will be an AVERAGE of 6 tries for each 99% item. This means that in those 6 attempts, 5 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .25 x 5) = material cost + (1.25 x material cost), or 2.25 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 2.25 times the material cost of item to produce a 99% item. The cost to the customer of 3-4x times the material cost provides a profit for the crafter.
98% items: 98% items have approx 1 in 6 change of being made. However, almost all decent crafters (including myself) will give a 99% item if they make it while crafting your order. This reduces the chance to getting a 98-99% item to 2 in 6, or one in 3. This means that there will be an AVERAGE of 3 tries for each 98-99% item. This means that in those 3 attempts, 2 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .25 x 2) = material cost + (.5 x material cost), or 1.5 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 1.5 times the material cost of item to produce a 98-99% item. The cost to the customer of 2x times the material cost provides a profit for the crafter.
Make sure you check with your crafter beforehand to see if they will give you a masterpiece if they get one while making your 98-99/whatever order. Some crafters will give you the mp, others won't. So be sure to ask. This is why the chance of getting a 100% item was not included in the 98-99% calculations.
The high markup for 100% items also comes from the fact that if 100% were affordable to everyone, crafters like myself would never sell any lower qualities like 99%. If you wish to obtain 100% items, get gloves, boots, maybe sleeves, as they are the cheapest parts to make. A 100% jerkin costs 5x as much to make as 100% gloves, yet they both will still have the same amount of spellcrafting points.
Suits of tier 10 armor cost the follow amount for the crafter to make, WITHOUT ANY RECRAFTS AT ALL:
Af102 studded: 726 gold
Af102 chain: 1300 gold
Af102 plate: 1450 gold
Af102 leather: 484 gold
Af49 cloth: 300 gold
As you can see, a full suit of plate costs the crafter 1450 gold to make, and that is with one try regardless of quality. For all these suits the jerkin alone accounts for about 40% of the total cost for the suit.
Before we begin, do your local spellcrafter a favor and download Leladia's Spellcraft Equipment Configurator . This program will allow you to calculate all the stats on your armor in a more thorough way than the herald calculator. This will help your local spellcrafter out a lot.
The material cost (or value) of an item is how much gold and silver worth of materials an item costs the crafter to make. The current by back rate for spellcrafted gems is 50-60% (most gems around 51-53%), so let's give crafters a hand and call the buy back rate 50%/ So, when you sell an item back to the vendor, you lose 50% of its material value. For example, if I make an gem that costs 20 gold in materials, ill only get 10 gold for that item when I sell it to a vendor. That 50% loss is often referred as to the recraft cost. So the recraft cost is equal to the material cost of the item times (.5).
note: It is extremely helpful if you know what stats you want on your item before you go to the spellcrafter. If you do not and just say i want (for example) body resist, con, hp, and +parry on my sword, what can i do, expect to pay an additional 2-3x the material cost on top of the prices below. This is just a pain for the spellcrafter and eats up a lot of time he deserves to be compensated for. Also, expect pricing to be higher for a good month or so. You want your stuff first, expect to pay a premium for it. Until there are more spellcrafters, the ones who got to 1001 first can charge whatever they want. Personally, i suggest you wait a little and them you will find getting your item imbued to be much cheaper.
When you are not overcharging: If you are not overcharging, then the quality of your gems does not matter. Therefore, if the item is grey, the spellcrafter will make it first try. Keep in mind that most gems cost less than 30 gold to make, and the average item will cost between 5-50gp worth of gems to imbue. I would say that anything up to a 2-3x material cost is a fair price to imbue items. If you are paying more than 150 gold to get an item imbued that doesn't have a focus gem on it you need to either find yourself another spellcrafter or wait until more spellcrafters skill up. Or make one yourself like the crafters like to say.
If you are overcharging: If you are overcharging, quality matters. A very great deal actually. A four to five point overcharge will require all 99-100% qual gems in order to have the best chance to be successful. Here are some expected prices for 98-100 gems:
98% quality gems: 3-4x cost
99% quality gems: 5-7x cost
100% quality gems: 28-30x cost
And now for a little math to explain where those numbers came from. Note that the formula for determining how much an item costs the crafter to make is:
Price = (material cost + recraft cost), and remember from above that recraft cost (for each try) = material cost x .5, so:
Price = material cost + (material cost x .5 x number of retries). This is not the cost to the customer; this is how much the item costs the crafter to make.
100% quality items (masterpieces): The odds of getting a masterpiece are 1 in 50. There will be an AVERAGE of 50 tries for each masterpiece. This means that in those 50 attempts, 49 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .5 x 49) = material cost + (24.5 x material cost), or 25.5 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 25.5 times the material cost of item to produce a masterpiece. The cost to the customer of 28-30 times the material cost provides a small profit for the crafter. As you can see, masterpiece gems are really not worth their price. They cost A LOT to make due to the low buy back rate. You are much better off buying 99 qual gems.
99% items: 99% items have approx 1 in 6 change of being made. This means that there will be an AVERAGE of 6 tries for each 99% item. This means that in those 6 attempts, 5 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .5 x 5) = material cost + (2.5 x material cost), or 3.5 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 3.5 times the material cost of item to produce a 99% item. The cost to the customer of 5-7x times the material cost provides a profit for the crafter. Note that for overcharging, 99 qual gems are much much more efficient and cheaper than 100 qual gems.
98% items: 98% items have approx 1 in 6 change of being made. However, almost all decent crafters (including myself) will give a 99% gem if they make it while crafting your order. This reduces the chance to getting a 98-99% item to 2 in 6, or one in 3. This means that there will be an AVERAGE of 3 tries for each 98-99% item. This means that in those 3 attempts, 2 of those will be retries and one will be the actual item. So the formula is: Price = material cost + (material cost x .5 x 2) = material cost + (1 x material cost), or 2 x material cost. So as you can see, it costs the crafter an average of 2 times the material cost of item to produce a 98-99% item. The cost to the customer of 3-4x times the material cost provides a profit for the crafter.
Clicking: Spellcrafting requires an insane amount of clicking. More so than any other tradeskill. However, spellcrafters never have to leave Camelot (or their respective home city), while the other crafters must venture to a relic or merchant keep in order to buy materials to make the best items. I see this as a fair tradeoff and see no reason to charge extra just because you have to click a lot. Just be glad you don't have to spend 20 minutes running (in albion, for example) to excalibur (which doesn't have a forge) to camelot all the time.
Currently nothing in Alchemy depends on quality. So really all you need is someone who can make the item you want. This makes alchemy a pretty simple skill. Please be sure to tell your alchemist the correct item. If you want a proc be sure to say proc and not charge, for example. A proc is something that fires off when you hit someone. A reverse proc goes off when you get hit. A charge is something you set off yourself. Since quality does not matter, if the item is grey to the alchemist, he will make it on the first try. A fair markup for these items would anything up to 1.75x material cost. Nothing in alchemy should cost more than 450g to get imbued. Also, expect pricing to be higher for a good month or so. You want your stuff first, expect to pay a premium for it. Until there are more alchemists, the ones who got to 1100 first can charge whatever they want. Personally, i suggest you wait a little and them you will find getting your item imbued to be much cheaper.
Prissy's Guide to Alchemy is an excellent site to learn specifics about Alchemy.
This method is becoming increasing popular with crafters. You see, the main problem with the pricing structure above is that it is based upon averages. Like over time things will even. The problem for crafters is that if a 99% item takes 33 tries to make, the crafter is going to be out a lot of money and profit if they use the averages method. The good thing about this pay-per-craft method is that it is independent and is not dependent upon averages.
Basically how it works is you give the crafter some money, say for example the material cost of the item you want plus whatever markup the crafter asks for for the first attempt, maybe for example something like 50gp or a % of the material cost, and he will make an item for you. If you like the quality of the item, you walk away with item, crafter walks away with his profit. If you don't like the quality of the item, the crafter will make another item. And so on until you get the desired quality you want or just give up, cut your losses, and take the highest quality item you got so far. With this method, it is the buyer that eats up any loss and not the crafter. The crafter may or may not charge a % markup for recrafts as well.
This will probably be easier understood by an example. Let's say a player wants an item that has a material cost of 100g. The crafter agrees to make the item with a 30% markup for the first try. So the player gives the crafter 130g and the crafter makes the item. It comes up at 95%. The customer decides he doesnt like it and asks for a recraft. This example crafter charges 20% markup for recrafts. The recraft cost for this item (assuming it is armor/weap and a gem or sc/alch item) is 75g, since you lose 25% when you sell back to a vendor. So each additional attempt will cost the customer 25+20% or 30g. Let's say it takes 5 tries till the player finally gets the quality he wants. So the total cost for the weapon is 100g (material cost) + 30g (first try crafter markup) + 4 x (25g [recraft cost] + 5g (20% markup for recrafts]) = 100+30+120 = 250 gold. So the item costs the customer 250 gold, and the crafter makes a profit of 50 gold. Keep in mind that this is just an example, and the markups are liable to change.
Martymacgraves said it best when he wrote: “We crafters didn't design this system; Mythic did.” It’s not our fault items costs so much and take so long to make. Another problem is that the crafting community has been ignored for months on end, and is just now being recognized.
I hope this “guide” help you understand our pricing a little bit more.